More on the Brockton Rox

Now that the indy pro Brockton Rox (Can-Am League) have decided to call it quits for the 2012 season, the city must grapple with the $3.2 million debt remaining on the bond used to build Campanelli Stadium.  Without a professional baseball tenant, paying the annual $900k bond payment just got a little tougher.  Rox CEO Chris Carminucci is in talks with the city to renegotiate the team’s $125,000 annual lease payment and possibly bring in a more economically-viable franchise from the Futures Collegiate Baseball League.  Read more here.

18 Comments

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18 responses to “More on the Brockton Rox

  1. Dan Rodriguez

    Yeah, Nick, I hear ya as far as new market but I feel the northeast is so heavily saturated already. Not as confident as you are about Stamford. Yeah, it would be a booming market but It’s too close to NYC to be an affiliated team. An Atlantic League team would be a fit but why place a team that you know would probably kill off another team in the same league? Who knows, it may help. Stamford, White Plains, Danbury, Yonkers these would all be good places. A lot of money being poured into White Plains as well.

  2. Nick

    Dan,

    I have done a lot of work most notably in the AHL and we had explored the possibility of Hartford and/or Stamford Expansion. I have a close colleague that I have done a lot of work with that was trying to return baseball to Atlantic City, and put expansion in one of the two mentioned above. The Bluefish would most certainly be dissolved which would surely add to the value of the Atlantic League as the Bluefish are in a City that people tend to just drive by in this present day as cities like Stamford, Milford, and White Plains are both easily accessible on Interstate 95 and off much more for people Jobs, Living, Entertainment, and Stamford has one of the Largest Financial Institutions in the Northeast as well as a county that is one of the wealthiest in America, a state that is ranked third in America for income and as a city and its surrounding cities average household income is well into the $100k range. All signs point to Stamford being a gold mine, and I would bet that Minor League Baseball will be there within 5 years. As for New Haven I think it could work good around Savin Rock in West Haven on the Waterfront as New Haven roads and highway traffic is why the Ravens left town. And I personally think that the Atlantic League would be foolish for entertaining Brockton. I know someone who is considering a Green Bay Packers stock offering approach for a new team and a privately financed ballpark in Stamford so NEW MARKETS is where the future is.

    Nick

  3. danrodriguez804

    Also, Nick, I wondered if CT could support more baseball, although not a great track record of support. Hartford area has a team with the Rockcats and Stamford is a booming area which one would think would be a great locale but would certainly mean the death of the Bridgeport Bluefish. I’d love to see a NYPL team in New Haven but that’s very unlikely. The Hagerstown Suns in the SAL are threatening relocation, I guess Kinston, NC could be an available market, but they have an old facility there too. I’d love to see them move to Rockland.

  4. danrodriguez804

    Yeah, Brian, which is so dumb. Imagine if you had to ask your competitor for permission before making a move. Yeah, but that was a report that was out.there I heard something about the Atlantic League going there too. Such a nice park and no disrespect to the Can-Am, but that park and market is too nice for a struggling league. It’s a shame to have these publicly financed ballparks sitting empty. What a waste. Like in AC and Sussex and I guess next up is Newark. The vultures are circling.

  5. Again Dan, the Yankees and Mets would have to both sign off on an affiliated team playing in Rockland. The fact that the Mets wouldn’t even sign off on the Yankees playing one season in Newark doesn’t give me much hope that an affiliated team could ever get into Rockland. The best you can hope for is an Atlantic League team, which would then at least be full season.

  6. Dan Rodriguez

    Good points, Nick. The only thing I’d disagree on is Rockland. They’re 45 minutes from NYC, in a beautiful park, in a growing area. Other teams around NYC are highly successful except for Newark. But there’s been some whispers about Rockland. There was a report that they were close to joining the South Atlantic League, which would be insane travel-wise but fun. I’d love to see them join the NYPL.

  7. Nick

    While the Can-Am League has never been a “Strong” hit occupying most of the markets that the Atlantic League deemed as failing markets (i.e. Newark Bears, Nashua Pride, Atlantic City Surf…), The Atlantic League is gold with Long Island, Somerset, Lancaster, York, Camden all putting together very competitive brands very close to affiliate or major league towns such as New York City, Philadelphia and Washington D.C. With Bridgeport finally making a profit after a few years in the dumps and Sugar Land and the beginning of the southern league beginning to form as well as 2013 entry Loudoun County, and maybe further down the line Malden, Hartford or Stamford the league looks to continue its growth and rank up there with some of the strongest Affiliate Leagues. The Can-Am League is a dying bread, it holds ZERO value, owners cannot sell teams or bring in good ownership groups. Brockton ceased operations in 2009 while Carminucci was the Field Manager and then the man brought his poor excuse for team management and business ethics that helped with the demise of the AC Surf under the tutelage of one of the Worst ownership groups in baseball Ventura Sports Group, Carminucci is highly under funded and with a lease that combined with the Shaw’s center approaches 600k there is no chance for success. Newark has been a case of Lies, Poor Leadership and now finally has owners that want to invest into their business to rebuild and re-brand the Bears organization but lets face it far too much damage has been made. Rockland is a good ballpark but how many teams 20 minutes outside of New York are going to survive…? Placement here I think was a bad idea…AC has a chance to come back so I have heard through grumblings from City officials but they think the ballpark still has the same value it once had as anyone that pays attention to this site and politics of minor league baseball it clearly is no better at this point then pittsfield. So while I think it is sad that Brockton, AC and other teams we have all loved watching over the years are gone. There are still fantastic possible locations in the northeast for minor league baseball on any level Indy or Affiliated.

  8. Dan Rodriguez

    Also steve, the fact that once Newark left the Atlantic League every team, even Bridgeport, reported a profit would define a team as successful. And those teams are in the Northeast except for perhaps Southern Maryland which is Mid Atlantic but that’s splitting hairs. The Indy Long Island Ducks outdrew the affiliated New Britain Rock Cats and Lowell Spinners, both in the northeast. Bus trips and low pay are hallmarks of life in the minors – any league. And the Atlantic League’s footprint is smaller than most pro leagues in the country, so much shorter rides Your facts are seriously skewed!

  9. Jerry Baseball

    Indy Ball is not dying. Although the Can-Am is not doing well The ATL is doing just fine. EVen as bad as the Can Am is the Jackels and Quebec are in good shape. The problem is that The Can-Am is having some issues that does not mean Indy ball in the NE is dying.

  10. Steve, how do you characterize success and what states does the northeast encompass ? If you are only including New England, indy baseball has never been a bit hit except for the first couple years the Bluefish were in existence. But if you include the Atlantic League and their footprint in what I consider the northeast, I’m not sure how you could argue that most of the teams haven’t been successful. In Long Island, Somerset, Lancaster, York, Southern Maryland, and Camden, that’s 6 strong markets And with Rockland and Quebec from the Can Am League doing well, that’s 8 total. What is your evidence that indy ball is dying ?

  11. steve winters

    Dan you mentioned 2 teams.

    i repeat 2 teams….how does that = success ???? please explain that one to me

    you gotta come with something better then that. it’s a dying breed, the economic of paying the players, all the travel, etc is impossible.

    especially when major sponsors aren’t dishing out the cash like they used too

  12. Dan Rodriguez

    I disagree with the comment that Indy ball is a dying breed especially in the northeast when there are several highly successful and well run franchises in the northeast like in Long Island and Somerset.

  13. steve winters

    ATlantic league, EAstern League, International LEague, New York Penn League. all will never touch brockton.

    its summer ball for Rox, looks like the guy above is right. futures league it is, better then nothing

  14. ROX TO Futures

    i only see brockton going the summer collegiate route. it’s impossible for them to go affiliate because of the Sox and PawSox. Indy ball is a dying breed, especially in the NOrtheast.

    The Futures League makes perfect sense because of the Rox owner (Carminucci) owns two teams in that circuit already.

    I heard the NECBL tried to inquire with the city, but were basically laughed at now, because of their failure to keep markets alive and report accurate attendance numbers.

    If I am a betting man, and I am!, i say the Rox go into the Futures Baseball LEague

    • Spectator777

      considering the same ownership group who owns the Rox also owns other Futures Teams and has skin in the Futures League, I would say thata a pretty safe bet.

  15. Dan Rodriguez

    Well they were all set to move into an existing ballpark in Richmond and Frederick, which would have seen attendance cut in half. I think Brockton could help set up the Atlantic League brand in Mass, then help facilitate a Malden addition. This can’t be good for the Can-Am. Newark is struggling mightily. Some whispers of Rockland jumping leagues already.

  16. Brian

    I doubt it, Dan. The Atlantic League likes to build new ballparks and break into areas that haven’t had minor league ball. Don’t see how Brockton would be a fit. Now if a place like Malden could get a park build, the AL might be interested.

    Brian

  17. danrodriguez804

    the Atlantic league is looking to get into the Boston area, I wonder if they could jump in here.

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